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Noise ordinance debate: How loud is too loud?
Kill Devil Hills commissioners want to know more about how loud the music really is at venues around town before deciding where to go with a new noise ordinance.
To help set a baseline, Town Attorney Steven Michael said Monday that police had checked areas of KDH with a decibel meter.
“The readings we got from various places did not demonstrate a significant noise problem,” Michael told the Board of Commissioners.
But Al Dugita, who spoke during public comments at Monday’s board meeting, said he had called police over the weekend about loud music coming from a DJ on an outdoor deck at the Pit around 1 a.m.
Dare County is also getting an earful about its proposed noise ordinance.
In many areas, the generally accepted threshold for residential neighborhoods is 60 decibels, which is about the level of a normal conversation.
But limits are applied to noise levels some distance from a source and often inside another building or home. So an ear-splitting band inside a bar could be no louder than a conversation inside a house a block away.
Kill Devil Hills now specifies 60 decibels in residential areas during the day and 55 at night. It adds that the acceptable maximum for amplified noise without a special permit is 65 decibels at the nearest public right-of-way.
The ordinance, however, does not set down times nor does it address levels in commercial areas where entertainment venues are located.
Michael said that several specific venues seemed to be the main sources of noise complaints. But the level might depend on the time of night, the kind of music or who’s in charge. Generally, when owners are informed, the volume is turned down. But owners are not always on site.
“We need to get some consistent readings from those,” he said.
The loudest reading measured in Kill Devil Hills was 84 decibels from an empty dumpster being dropped to the ground, he said. According to a chart on the Dare County website, that’s about the same as a passing diesel truck or a snow blower.
Also to be considered is whether a higher commercial or the residential level would be applied if a homeowner or renter complained about loud music from a nearby bar or restaurant.
The town board decided to get more readings and see what happens at a public hearing before county commissioners next week.
A new ordinance in Dare County could have a significant impact on Hatteras Island.
Last month, commissioners sent a proposal back to the Planning Board for reworking. It had specified 60 decibels in residential areas from 7 a.m. to 10 p.m. and 50 overnight. In commercial and public areas, the maximim would be 65 decibels and in industrial areas, 70.
The County Planning Board heard public comments Monday night about the ordinance. Concerns were mainly expressed by wedding planners and the owner of Real Watersports, which stages several major events a year.
Planning Director Donna Creef said issues for consideration that she will bring to the Board of Commissioners next Monday is looking at 11 p.m. instead of 10 p.m. as the latest hour for higher levels.
Also brought up at a hearing Monday, she said, was the possibility of a three-day maximum for a special permit allowing a venue to exceed the limit. Trip Forman, an owner of Real Watersports, said seven days should be allowed. His business sponsors a seven-day kiteboarding event in June.
Rental houses that are marketed as wedding venues could also be affected by a new ordinance. Limiting special permits to one per quarter would cut into their business.
Because the existing ordinance generally prohibits loud disturbing noises, enforcement is subjective, Creef said. The county had received complaints about outdoor music at restaurants on Hatteras Island and had felt the need to establish specific and objective levels.
The draft ordinance says authorities will first ask that the volume be turned down before considering a citation. But whatever happens, the sheriff’s department won’t be patrolling for offenses or raiding wedding parties.
“Noise ordinances are complaint-driven,” Creef said.
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skiffguide says:
Perhaps they could measure the decibel level of traffic on 158 in front of Lowes, The Dare Center, or French Fry Alley and use it as a baseline.
Obviously says:
So are these Governments going to supply decibel meters and training to the Cops, or are they (Cops) expected to do so on their own budgetary dimes? Don’t expect adequate enforcement (via calls of complaints) if the meters aren’t provided.
Matt says:
I bet the County & Town(s) will exclude the nuisance being created by the local municipal gun range…
Surflistener says:
Wait a minute. What is the noise level of a breaking wave? I’ve been raised out of a dead sleep many times by the sounds of the surf. I wonder if the noise meters will be getting bleed over from these crashing wave sounds when they are monitoring noise levels of parties near the beach?????????
Beach Bouy says:
What needs to be measured is the sound of a Harley with straight pipes. Just one would be loud enough to peg the meter. Two or three together revving the engine like they’re leaving a stop light would probably break the meter.
CCC Albatross says:
Will the noice limits also apply to the 3am garbage trucks?
kenobx says:
I sell dishwashers and the quietest that we sell is 48db. The cheapest dishwasher is 64db. If either was running on the edge of my property, I would not hear it in my house. Will we no longer have fireworks on the 4th of July? Will the Lost Colony no longer have fireworks as part of the show? No music at Dare Days? Music at outdoor weddings? There may be a need for limits, but 50 to 60 is just too low!
Beth Gordon says:
Should the reading be measured from the distance of the complaint to the location of the reported noise? Also, should the noise threshold be different in primarily
residential areas as opposed to resort areas? What about Bike Week? Maybe, general guidelines could be subject to some flexibility based on circumstances, as determined by investigating officer.
comfortablybum says:
It’s really the bass that travels long distances and transfers through walls. So this is going to affect music more than anything. Also most of the noise described above is temporary, not like a concert that lasts an hour.
I don’t think anyone who builds or rents a house as close to the bypass as the pit should be able to complain about noise. Where are all the libertarians and property rights proponents on this one? I might tend to agree with you.
Jdog says:
What a waste of time.
Frank Moore says:
When will the “leaders” of KDH ever address the really important issues facing our lovely town, most importantly the mismanagement of our police department by “do it my way or the highway” Britt ?? So much time spent talking about nothing of major importance while important issues are swept under the Town Managers and BOC members collective rugs.
chaser says:
I told them to turn the amp up to 11, and quit playing the rock and or roll.
KDH Resident says:
Frank – when are you going to step up to the plate and run for office???
XZDC says:
…………”….about the same as a snow blower.” ?? Really ? Who on OBX knows or remembers how loud they are. lol Come on folks.
)
KDH Rezident Evil says:
I think the definition of “continuous” is going to be a key element of whatever rule they consider, and they are almost going to have to get into the permitting business unless they want to write in exceptions for every little thing (like the aforementioned fireworks, trash trucks, and wedding parties).
RnR says:
CANT tell you how nice it is to see our officials waste time with stupid crap like this. How loud is too loud? When its bothering the most of your neighbors. Then you know what you do? You walk over to the house and kindly ask them to turn it down. WHAT DID I JUST SAY? THATS RIGHT! GET OFF UR BUTT AND WALK OVER AND ASK YOUR NEIGHBOR…WOW NEVER THOUGHT OF THAT!! If they continue to be loud, then call the police to intervine. WE dont need our officials wasting the little brains they have on such a small matter! GROW UP AND USE THE BUMP 3 FEET ABOVE UR BUM
lunchbox says:
here is a decibel chart: as you can see in order to enforce these regulations the construction industry will be greatly effected ss heavy equipment during the day is more of nuisance then any music at 10pm.
Weakest sound heard 0dB
Whisper Quiet Library at 6′ 30dB
Normal conversation at 3′ 60-65dB
Telephone dial tone 80dB
City Traffic (inside car) 85dB
Train whistle at 500′, Truck Traffic 90dB
Jackhammer at 50′ 95dB
Subway train at 200′ 95dB
Level at which sustained exposure may result in hearing loss 90 – 95dB
Hand Drill 98dB
Power mower at 3′ 107dB
Snowmobile, Motorcycle 100dB
Power saw at 3′ 110dB
Sandblasting, Loud Rock Concert 115dB
Pain begins 125dB
Pneumatic riveter at 4′ 125dB
Bob Samuels says:
Buy some ear plugs!
It’s summertime, its the beach. Remember when YOU were 20 something? Chillax and let’em have some fun.
Frank says:
I don’t want to hear your music. Get in your car roll up the windows and blow your ears out for all I care.
Why should anyone have to listen to something they do not want to hear especially when some of us have to go to work early in the morning. Inconsiderate narcissistic fools!
Kdh resident says:
Oh come on frank, you didn’t really think it was going to be much different here than where you came from did you?
RAP MAN says:
Can we put a noise meter on Frank? I think he is exceeding safe levels on the BS he puts out. He is also known,in some circles,as IKE. I KNOW EVERYTHING.
KDH Resident says:
Frank’s attitude sounds like those that want to be last over the bridge and make the OBX like it was where they came from. Wasn’t he the one who was all for Lowe’s and now the parking lot sits practically empty?? Sure doesn’t look like they’re doing a booming business there.
RL says:
It’s all about respect. If you can’t do it, the law will make you do it.
skiffguide says:
Frank sounds like an old, unhappy grump- what makes them narcisstic Frank, please explain that one. Go dance alittle,and try minding your own business- just MAYBE you’ll be happier. If that doesn’t work soundproof your home, wear earplugs and isolate yourself from all other life. You should have spent a little time in the Casino man.
Steve says:
I would think this pertains to rental houses and not businesses.
It is the rentals that cause all the disturbances.
If we have a noise ordinance, we should have a light ordinance also to minimize light pollution. HA
h2o says:
It has come to my attention that the BOC is considering a noise ordinance for unincorporated areas of Dare Co., a 24 hour/60 decibel ordinance is what I am told you are considering. Have you all taken leave of your senses? 60 decibels? So now children playing in their yards are to be criminals? Neighbors shouting “Hi” across the yards could be arrested? 60 decibels is just above the noise level of an average conversational tone. We have a Sheriff’s Dept. that is already taxed with trying to confront some of the real criminal issues in this county, drugs, gang crime, domestic violence, etc., now you are trying place on them the burden of enforcing something that not only is ludicrous in nature, but unenforceable from the standpoint that they’d have to arrest or cite everyone at one time or another. The Tourist Bureau is spending how many millions of our dollars trying to attract visitors to The Outer Banks, and now you’re trying to tell them to shut up when they get here. How many laws/ordinances do we really need to protect us? Certainly not this one, an ordinance of this nature would place an uneccesary onus on every business owner on the Outer Banks. And which mensa candidate said that weddings constituted only 3% of our local economy? Are they aware that the Outer Banks is one of the top 2-3 wedding destinations in America? For instance one couple comes here for a July Wedding and rent a 8 bedroom home. You have 16 people staying in this cottage that are not only paying a tax to stay there, but buying groceries, tee shirts, eating out, buying gas, playing putt putt. so on and so forth, and you are collecting taxes from them at every turn. Now they have to pay your taxes and be quiet doing it. Doesn’t sound like a place I’d like to come back to were I a visitor. An ordinance of the nature that you propose would be shooting the local economy in the foot. I am a wedding officiant, and I assure you that I have not conducted a ceremony, nor am I likely to, that will not exceed 60 decibels. Maybe some you on the board should get out and get some fresh air, and talk to some real people and come back to earth before you go making decisions such as these.
Empty Sea says:
“Noise Ordinances are Complaint-driven”
So, the cops don’t care as long as no one else cares? Cool! Oh wait….So all someone has to do is complain that THEY think it’s too loud?
I guess we’ll just have to sound-proof the outer banks beach club on the outside. So the octogenarians that stay there don’t have to turn down their hearing-aid volumes because someone farted 3 blocks away.
“Habitual Complainers”, who just enjoy getting their own way and making other people feel bad, you need to ask yourself a question before you decide to call the cops on the wedding party 2 doors down, or the band playing at a local bar to entertain the tourists that pay our summer salaries:
“Are they really hurting anybody?”
Just because you may be able to hear something, does not make it “too loud!” Especially not bad enough to file a formal complaint and make our boys in blue come out. Why don’t you get off you ass and go ask them to turn it down, yourself? I’m sure they wouldn’t mind, if you were nice about it? Or better yet, why don’t you stay and have a drink and calm the F*** down!
But if you want to be a jerk about it and send the cops, go ahead. But if that’s how you want to play, then your Peace deserves to be disturbed!
Amanda says:
What about the noise levels of all the generators after a hurricane? Will they be out issuing tickets then? I agree this seems like a huge waste of time. If you have a problem, deal with it directly! Keep the government out of people’s lives, we need less, not more!
Kdh resident says:
What about that obnoxious neighbor who thinks its ok to mow their lawn at 7am?
Steve says:
7am is the best time to mow. We are all early birds anyways. Night-life is non-existant here.
Hidin' Sikh says:
Remember when you used to sweep a sidewalk with a broom? Leaf blowers are one of the most obnoxious inventions ever.
This blog is ridiculous says:
Do any of you have anything to do other than complain and make ridiculous proposals? Why not go to a town meeting and voice your opinions and concerns where it counts! If a quarter of you showed up it wold be worth the laugh when listening to you! Before you submit your post next time, read it out loud and see if you make sense. If you think you do make sense, step away from the computer for a while. Come back and read your post out loud again. Then and only then if you think your not another Frank, hit Submit!
Jon says:
“Noise” is not the problem. It is the abuse of the “right” or “ability” to make that noise. A leaf blower that is used for an hour or two is one thing. An external sound system that is playing music from 10 am – 2 am seven days a week is something else entirely. If that music is audible beyond the property line of the business or residence, then that music becomes a “nuisance noise”. Why should someone be subjected to that “nuisance noise” without some way to address the issue?
A lot of businesses on the OBX now advertise “live music” on their decks, etc. Most of them keep the sound level so low that you must be within 50 feet to really hear the music. A few locations play the music loud enough to be heard 2 blocks away – until 10 pm or later. The latter example is a “nuisance” and should be written a citation by the local PD.
Imagine this: a residence located about 60 yards across the beach road from a business; the business advertises live DJs and live yard music; the residence’s doors and windows are kept closed; the residence uses central aid conditioning; the residence has “sound machines” in each bedroom; the residence has installed custom (read expensive) blinds in some windows to block the light coming from the business at night. But, despite all the changes made to the beach house in order to deal with the music, the residents still hear the music until 2 am; the residents can still feel the “thump” of the bass; “customers” yell and scream throughout the night as they enjoy the yard games and music; traffic (read thumping audio systems and exhaust systems designed to make noise) congregates at the location throughout the night. And, this takes place 5 – 7 nights a week – every week.
The bottom line is that “noise” on the OBX, and specifically in KDH, has gotten out of control. Now that cat has to be put back in the bag. And, if you doubt that, just remember, unless you have to deal with the “noise” on a daily and nightly basis, you really don’t know what you are talking about. It’s easy to say that “noise” isn’t a problem when you can escape the “noise” by leaving the location and going home. Because of the location of their residence or vacation home, some folks can’t escape the noise.